Tuesday, February 03, 2009

Understanding Micheli #1: Why He Rejected All Rudy Guede’s Explanations As Fiction

Posted by Brian S

Here now is the full 2011 Micheli Report kindly translated by Catnip for the Wiki and TJMK.

On Guede

Judge Micheli has had two very important roles. He presided over Rudy Guede’s trial and sentencing, and he presided over the final hearing that committed Raffaele Sollecito and Amanda Knox to trial.

A week ago, just within the three-month deadline, Judge Micheli made public the 106-page report that explains the thinking behind both actions. This is a public document, and in the enviable Italian legitimizing process, the public is encouraged to get and read the report and to understand the full rationales. Excellent analyses have already appeared in Italian in Italy, but no English-speaking sources on the facts of the case have either put the report into English or published more than the most superficial analysis.

These posts will examine several very key areas of the report so that we too may choose whether to buy into the rationales. The translations into English here were by native-Italian speakers and fellow posters Nicki and Catnip. The next post will explain why Micheli ruled out the Lone Wolf Theory, and why he concluded that Knox and Sollecito appeared to be implicated in Meredith’s murder and should therefore be sent to trial.

Judge Micheli maintained that from the moment Meredith’s body was discovered until his arrest in Germany on November 19th, Rudy Guede was in a position to compile a version of his involvement in events at the cottage which would minimise his reponsibilities and point the finger of guilt elsewhere.

He was able to follow the course of the investigation in newspapers and on the internet. He would know of the arrests of Amanda, Raffaele and Patrick. He would know that the investigators had found biological evidence which would sooner or later connect him to the murder, and he would know of other discoveries and evidence which had been publicised in the media.

His story as told in Germany was compiled with all the knowledge about the crime and investigation he would have sought out. On his return to Italy in December he was interviewed by the investigating authorities and gave version 2. He was interviewed again in March which resulted in version 3, and later still made a spontaneous statement to change one or two facts including the admission that the trainer footprint in Meredith’s room could be his. Judge Micheli said:

Analyzing the narratives of the accused…he is not credible, as I will explain, because his version is (1) unreliable, and (2) continuously varying, whether on basic points or in minor details and outline.

Micheli then examined the details of Rudy’s claimed meeting with Meredith which resulted in his invitation to the cottage on the evening of November 1st.

He noted there were substantial differences between his versions of December and March, particularly with regard to the location of his meeting with Meredith on the night of Halloween and his movements in the early evening of November 1st.

He considered it likely that Rudy had made these changes as he became aware of evidence which contradicted his December version. Notably, in December Rudy claimed to have had his meeting with Meredith which resulted in her invite at a Halloween party given by Spanish students.

By March it was well known that Meredith had spent her entire Halloween in the company of friends, first in the Merlin pub before they later moved on to Domus disco. In March Rudy changed the location of his meeting with her from the Spanish party to Domus, which by chance Rudy had also attended following the party. However, neither Meredith’s friends who were continuously in her company nor those who accompanied Rudy to the Domus witnessed any meeting between the two. Judge Micheli commented:

On 26 March 2008, instead, Rudy explained to the Prosecution, drawing a picture, that the group invited to the Spaniards’ house actually moved wholus-bolus to the “Domus” club, but it was right in that nightclub that he met Kercher, and not before; offering up a tour-guide description from the chair, saying, “there’s a bar for the drinks and then there’s a room, there’s an arch and a room. I walking [sic] around there, and that’s where I met Meredith”. On the facts of the meeting and the subject of the conversation, he elaborated: “I started talking to Meredith “¦talking anyway I gave her a kiss.. after which I told her how much I liked her and asked her if the next day, in all the confusion anyway, if we were going to meet the next day and she said yes (”¦), we met in the evening around half eight, like that.

While not intending to explore the question, basically irrelevant, of whether the pair had agreed to a more or less specific time (his confirmation of the suggestion of 8.30 pm in both verbal statements however allows the inference that according to Guede they had an appointment), the patent contradiction between the two versions jumps out. One context, of a room between two bathrooms, in an apartment, is completely different to that of a drinks-bar and an arch, in a pub; one might concede, perhaps, the possibility of forgetting which place it was where they last bumped into a friend, but hardly the first time there was a kiss with a girl towards whom one was attracted.

With regard to his movements in the early evening of November 1st, Rudy’s friend Alex failed to corroborate Rudy’s December claim to have visited his flat. He said he didn’t see Rudy either before or after his meeting with Meredith at her cottage.

In March, Rudy changed his story and claimed to have risen at 6pm(following the all-nighter at Domus) before wandering around town for an hour or so. He then said he went to Meredith’s cottage but received no answer so he carried on to Piazza Grimana in the hope he might see people he knew. He thought he arrived in the Piazza at around 7:30pm. He claimed that some time later he left Piazza Grimana and called at the Kebab shop before returning to Meredith’s cottage and arriving some time between 8:30 and 9:00pm.

He said he then waited until her arrival some time just after 9:00pm. It was noted that in both his December and March versions Rudy said he had arranged to meet Meredith at 8:30pm. Micheli noted that this didn’t sit well with another arrangement Rudy had made to meet Carlos (from the Spanish party) between 9:00 and 10:00pm.

Micheli said that neither version of Rudy’s movements could be treated as true because he changed his story to fit facts as they became known and there was absolutely no corroborating witness evidence.

Rudy claimed two situations evolved following his entry with Meredith into the apparently empty cottage:

Whilst he was having a drink of fruit juice from the fridge, he claims Meredith found that 300 euros (her rent money) was missing from her bedside cabinet. Meredith was naturally upset by this discovery and straight away blamed “druggy Amanda”. Rudy said they both checked Amanda’s room to see if the money was there. However, it couldn’t be found and Rudy sought to console her.

He says that this consolation developed into an amorous encounter which proceeded to the stage where “Meredith asked him” if he had a condom. He told he didn’t and since she didn’t either they stopped their lovemaking.

Judge Micheli had a real problem with this story as told by Guede. He found it unlikely that Meredith would be interested in lovemaking so soon following the discovery that her money was missing. He found it unlikely that it was Meredith who was leading the way in this amorous encounter as Rudy was suggesting with his claim that it was “Meredith who asked him” if he had a condom.

Surely, Micheli reasoned, if Rudy was hoping to indulge in a sexual encounter with Meredith following the previous night’s flirting, he would, as any young man of his age, ensure that he arrived with a condom in anticipation of the hoped for liason. But even if he didn’t, and it was true that events had reached the stage where Meredith asked him, then surely given his negative response, Meredith would have again gone into Amanda’s room where, as she had told her friends, condoms were kept by her flat mate. Judge Micheli simply didn’t believe that if they had got to the stage of lovemaking described by Rudy, and following his negative response to her question, they just “STOPPED”. Meredith would have known she had a probable solution just metres away.

Rudy claimed he then told Meredith he had an upset stomach because of the kebab he had eaten earlier. She directed him to the bathroom through the kitchen.

Rudy put on his i-pod and headphones as he claimed was his habit when using the toilet. In his December version Rudy said the music was so loud he heard the doorbell ring but he made no reference to hearing any conversation. A perfect excuse, Judge Micheli says, for not hearing the disturbance or detail of Meredith’s murder. However, in his March version he claims he heard Amanda’s voice in conversation with Meredith. When Rudy did eventually emerge from the bathroom he says he saw a strange man with a knife and then a prone Meredith. Micheli commented:

...it is necessary to take as given that, in this case, Kercher did not find anything better to do than to suddenly cross from one moment of tenderness and passion with him to a violent argument with someone else who arrived at that place exactly at the moment in which Rudy was relieving himself in the bathroom. In any case, and above all, that which could have been a surprise to the killers, that is to say his presence in the house, was, on the other hand, certainly not put into dispute:

Meredith, unlike the attackers, knew full well that in the toilet there was a person who she herself allowed in, so for this reason, in the face of someone who had started raising their voice, then holding her by the arms and ending with brandishing a knife and throwing her to the floor, why would she not have reprimanded/reproached/admonished him immediately saying that there was someone in the house who could help her?

“¦Meredith didn’t shout out loudly for Rudy to come and help
“¦There was a progression of violence
“¦The victim sought to fight back

If it is reasonable to think that a lady living 70 metres away could hear only the last and most desperate cry of the girl ““ it’s difficult to admit that Guede’s earphones, at 4-5 metres, would stop him hearing other cries, or the preceding sounds.

Micheli was also mystified as to why Amanda (named in Rudy’s March version) would ring the doorbell. Why wouldn’t she let herself in using her own key? He supposed it was possible Meredith had left her own key in the door which prevented Amanda from using hers, but the girls all knew the lock was broken and they were careful not to leave their own key in the door. Perhaps, Meredith wanted some extra security/privacy against someone returning and had left her key in the lock on purpose. Maybe Amanda was carrying something heavy and her hands weren’t free. Or, maybe, Rudy was just trapped by his December story of the doorbell when he didn’t name anybody and an anonymous ring on the doorbell was plausible.

The judge then took issue with Rudy’s description of events following the stabbing of Meredith. Rudy claimed that when he emerged from the bathroom he discovered a man with a knife standing over Meredith. In the resultant scuffle he suffered cut wounds to his hand. armed himself with chair to protect himself. before the attacker fled when he fell over because his trousers came down around his ankles. Micheli said that those who saw Rudy later that night didn’t notice any wounds to Rudy’s hands although some cuts were photographed by the police when he was later arrested in Germany.

Micheli found Rudy’s claim that the attacker ran from from the house shouting “black man found, black man guilty” unbelievable in the situation. In the panic of the moment it may be conceivable that the attacker could shout “Black man…, run” following the surprise discovery of his presence in the house, but in the situation Rudy describes, blame or expressions of who the culprit thought “the police would find guilty” made no sense. It would be the last thing on an unknown attackers mind as he sought to make good his escape.

Micheli considers the “black man found, black man guilty” statement an invention made up by Rudy to imply a possible discrimination by the authorities and complicate the investigation. Micheli also saw this as an excuse by Rudy to explain away his failure to phone for help (the implication being that a white man could have made the call). It was known by her friends and acquaintances that Meredith was never without her own phone switched on. She kept it so, because her mother was ill and she always wanted to be available for contact should her mother require help when she was on her own

Judge Micheli regarded Rudy’s claimed efforts to help Meredith impossible to believe, given the evidence of Nara Capezzali. Rudy claimed to have made trips back and forth to the bathroom to obtain towels in an attempt to staunch the flow of bood from Meredith’s neck. He claimed to have leaned over her as she attempted to speak and written the letters “AF” on the wall because he couldn’t understand her attempted words. His described activities all took time and Rudy’s flight from the house would have come minutes after the time he alleged the knife-man ran from the cottage.

Nara Capezzali maintained that after she heard Meredith’s scream it was only some seconds (well under a minute) before she heard multiple footsteps running away. Although she looked out of her window and continued to listen for some time because she was so disturbed by the scream, she neither heard nor saw any other person run from the house. That Rudy had run wasn’t in doubt because of his collision on the steps above with the boyfriend of Alessandra Formica. Micheli therefore considered it proven that “all” of Meredith’s attackers, including Rudy, fled at the same time.

Earlier in his report Micheli considered character evidence on Rudy given by witnesses for both prosecution and defense. Although he had been seen with a knife on two occasions, and was considered a bit of a liar who sometimes got drunk, the judge didn’t consider that Rudy had previously shown a propensity for violence, nor behaviour towards girls which differed markedly from that displayed by many other young men of his age.

However, because of the wealth of forensic evidence [on which more later] and his admitted presence in the cottage, combined with his total disbelief in Rudy’s statements, Micheli found Rudy guilty of participation in the murder of Meredth Kercher.

He sentenced him to 30 years in prison and ordered him to pay compensation of E2,000,000 each to Meredith’s parents John and Arline Kercher, E1,500,000 each to Meredith’s brothers John and Lyle Kercher plus E30,000 costs in legal fees/costs + VAT. Also E1,500,000 plus E18,000 in legal fees/costs + VAT to Meredith’s sister, Stephanie Kercher.


I have nothing else to add to this other than my admiration for those who put the post together.  The 106 pages of verdict would be terrifying in English so to have these sections translated/summarised is superb. 

I would like to note to the FOA who, in a post on a news site (I think Sam/DJ was the one who shouted me down), told me that the Kercher’s lawyer was free and provided by the Italian state.  Look at the amount of money awarded to Stephanie Kercher.  Who is paying for the lawyer Maresca then?  If it is the Kercher’s like I always suspected, the people of Seattle need to know about that before the next fundraiser.

Posted by daisysteiner on 02/03/09 at 06:27 PM | #

“Analyzing the narratives of the accused…he is not credible, as I will explain, because his version is (1) unreliable, and (2) continuously varying, whether on basic points or in minor details and outline.”

Thanks, Brian (and Catnip and Nicki) for this painstaking translation and analysis. If this is “theorizing,” as Anne Bremner has accused, it is theorizing of the most thorough kind. It is exactly what one would expect from a judge explaining why he has come to the conclusions he has come to. And who can argue with these conclusions?

Micheli has essentially deconstructed every single aspect of Rudy’s narrative, showing exactly where and why it does not hang together. I expect he will do the same with the narratives of the two other suspects. And when all of the fudging and the falsehoods and the shifting stories have been stripped away, then what is left can serve as the basis for establishing some kind of truth. As I understand it, this is the goal of the Italian system of justice, to arrive at the truth.

Posted by Skeptical Bystander on 02/03/09 at 06:32 PM | #

Thank you Brian for putting together such a well constructed article and thanks also to Nicki and Catnip for your excellent translation work that made it possible. I also echo all of Skep’s comments.

This excerpt has also told us something else new:

“Micheli said that those who saw Rudy later that night didn’t notice any wounds to Rudy’s hands although some cuts were photographed by the police when he was later arrested in Germany.”

Finally we have verification that Rudy did not have cuts to has hands on the night of the murder. Long ago, back in the TC (now PMF) Haloscan days, we had asserted that the most likely explanation for Rudy’s cut hand when he was arrested was actually self inflicted long after the murder in order to lend credence to his very weak story.

It is heartening to see confirmation that we have been correct in our conclusions. It also brings us closer to our goal of reaching the ‘truth’ of what happened that night. The lack of cuts to Rudy’s hand on the night of the murder now allows us to discard any theories that there may have been a violent fall out-between Rudy and Raffaele on the night of the murder. Therefore, the case has now been simplified to some extent, and that is progress.

Posted by Michael on 02/03/09 at 07:18 PM | #

Daisysteiner Wrote:

“I would like to note to the FOA who, in a post on a news site (I think Sam/DJ was the one who shouted me down), told me that the Kercher’s lawyer was free and provided by the Italian state.”

We must also not forget the fact that the Kerchers also have other costs as well as legal representation…numerous trips to Italy and accommodation whilst they are there, to name just some of them.

Posted by Michael on 02/03/09 at 07:21 PM | #

Thank you Brian, Catnip and Nicki, for such a good job!

Your hard work in translating the GUP Micheli’s report is very much appreciated. Looking forward to see more translated parts of this 106 page document.

Posted by Jools on 02/03/09 at 07:53 PM | #

Thanks Brian and everyone who worked on getting this translated in manner that wouldn’t be humiliating to Meredith.

Am I correct that you aren’t going to translate all of it and post due to some of the more gruesome details and out of respect for Meredith and her family?  That’s really cool.

Posted by Corrina on 02/03/09 at 09:29 PM | #

Corrina, you are one of the kindest and most caring of members of this pro-Meredith community, and it seems that you have already answered your own question.

For the family.

And for Meredith.

None of us ever knew Meredith as she was in her short life. But we have come to know her a little in death, and to understand her truly horrific last half-hour.

So we try to do what we think she would have wanted. At all times.

Posted by Peter Quennell on 02/04/09 at 03:05 AM | #

Deepest appreciation for what you three have done to enlighten everyone. It doesn’t get any better than getting to the truth - you all made that possible.

The day will come when the people of Seattle will know the truth and will act in kindness to show their support.  I trust that.  Until then, thank you from one citizen of Seattle.

Posted by Professor Snape on 02/04/09 at 07:31 AM | #

Much behind-the-scenes appreciation too for the days of work by Brian, Nicki and Catnip that this took - this and the next post, on why Judge Micheli felt Sollecito and Knox deserved to be sent to trial.

Nicki and Catnip of course translated very much more of Judge Micheli’s very elegant and precise report than is quoted above. That will help all of us in the posts coming up.

Regular readers, forgive us if we hold back on new posts for a few more hours, and allow this one to breath.

Posted by Peter Quennell on 02/04/09 at 06:23 PM | #

Thank you for this wonderful post, the skill, quality, time and effort that goes into these posts never ceases to impress me TJMK is fantastic and it shows in every single post, every single time.

Posted by Miss Represented on 02/04/09 at 10:34 PM | #

Regarding the existence of the letters “AF” written in Meredith’s blood on her wall, has anyone postulated publicly in court or otherwise that Meredith could have been writing the initials of her killer, i.e. “AK”, instead of “AF”? I have seen on TJMK someone indicating “AF” could have been for Raf. Mez hardly knew him and might not have recalled his name at all, let alone under such circumstances of his death.  Also, I think the betrayal of a near-stranger would pale in comparison to the psychological trauma of being physically and emotionally violated by someone familiar. I think it’s more probable that, assuming Mez was the author, she would have written Amanda’s initials with what energy she had left. Is there a thread on this subject on TJMK I have missed? Thanks in advance to all the great TJMK and PMF writers/collaborators and those who support justice for Meredith and her family.

Posted by all4justice on 04/04/11 at 01:02 AM | #

P.S.  Was it ever legally established or forensically proven that RG was the one who wrote on the wall in Meredith’s blood? Thanks.

Posted by all4justice on 04/04/11 at 01:15 AM | #


“Regarding the existence of the letters “AF” written in Meredith’s blood on her wall….”

I believe Guede’s claim “..... to have leaned over her as she attempted to speak and written the letters “AF” on the wall because he couldn’t understand her attempted words.”

Meredith’s injuries prevented her from phonating.

Meredith could inhale and exhale, but she could not even whisper, let alone scream, could not cough, and could not sneeze.

She could kind-of sigh, but without any sigh-phonation.

I believe that what Guede says he heard was the noise she made - the only noise she could make - a kind of sigh.

To me it adds credence to his statement.

Posted by Cardiol MD on 04/04/11 at 03:51 AM | #

The point surely is that there was no evidence that Guede even attempted to write AF? Had there been such evidence his statement would have looked a little different. AK or RS might have washed the letters away. Were the walls ever sprayed with luminol?

Posted by James Raper on 04/04/11 at 11:35 AM | #


To me the point is what Guede is reported to have claimed.

Posted by Cardiol MD on 04/04/11 at 02:24 PM | #


The NATO military alphabet would call Meredith’s last words, AF, Alpha Foxtrot.

Posted by Hopeful on 04/04/11 at 04:00 PM | #

An apparent misconception re the murder-scene had been niggling me for some time.

So when all4justice posted:

“Regarding the existence of the letters “AF” written in Meredith’s blood on her wall….”

I took the opportunity to bring it up.

What has niggled me is the implication in various reports that after Meredith’s trachea was slit open she nevertheless screamed, coughed, spoke, or otherwise phonated.

It is almost impossible for her to have done any such thing, and most improbable that she did!

Although the Massei [English Translation] Report cites expert witnesses who did realize the speech-consequences of her injuries, various reports seem not-to-realize those consequences, and I even suspect some TJMKers may not realize them.

So, at the risk of restating the obvious, here goes:


I know this from caring for hundreds of patients whose trachea we intentionally slit open, in the performance of a therapeutic tracheostomy [sic], for the purpose of artificial ventilation.

In order to phonate air has to be forced through the larynx.

If the trachea is open below the larynx the breathing actions called exhalation and inhalation will permit the air to bypass the larynx and THE PERSON CANNOT SPEAK.

If such patients, with long-term tracheostomies want to speak the hole has to be closed so that the air is not permitted to bypass the larynx , and IS forced up through the larynx.

Currently a specially designed automatic valve is inserted into the tracheostomy to permit phonation.

Otherwise, such a tracheostomized person cannot even whisper, let alone scream, cannot cough, and cannot sneeze. [They can kind-of sigh, but without any sigh-phonation]

There is a published time-line, in which after “a final blow to Meredith’s throat with the kitchen knife” she is “ coughing up blood” :

» Wed Dec 16, 2009 5:21 pm
Trans: Jools, Fly By Night

“........23:40 - ...... Meredith releases an agonizing cry, which was heard by witnesses. Amanda then moves to silence her and, according to the prosecutors reconstruction, delivers a final blow to Meredith’s throat with the kitchen knife: the wound is mortal and Meredith falls to the ground.

[Comment by Cardiol: It would be more clear to the reader if it stated that “the wound is eventually mortal and instantly silences Meredith who falls to the ground.]

23:45 – Meredith is helped to her feet by Rudy and is coughing up blood. The English girl, now dying, is then dragged to the side and the undressing continues…....”

[[Comment by Cardiol: It would be more clear to the reader if it stated that “ Meredith is helped to her feet by Rudy and is exhaling blood, but because her trachea has been slashed wide-open, not only is she unable to scream, she cannot even whisper, let alone cough.” 

Rudy’s allegation, supported by the blood-smear “AR” on the bedroom-wall, may well reasonably represent the sound Meredith made as her cough-reflex was triggered by the blood as she inhaled it].

I have not seen the Prosecution’s hypothetical video on the murder, but it is my understanding that it depicts the Scream as occurring AFTER her trachea was slit open, and after the arterial blood-spray.

If Prosecution’s hypothetical video does so then it is mistaken.

The most-probable killing-sequence is:
1. Meredith screams!
2. The killers panic.
3. In their panic they slit open the trachea.
4. The slitting-open of the trachea and arterial blood spray were probably almost synchronous, exacerbating the panic.
5. Although unlikely, the blood-spray could have preceded the slitting-open of the trachea, could have preceded the scream, and triggered the panic, but no scream or coughing should have followed that opening of the trachea!

So, when Guede is reported to have claimed

“...to have leaned over her as she attempted to speak and written the letters “AF” on the wall because he couldn’t understand her attempted words.”

the point to me is that this lends credence to the claims that:




Here are some relevant Massei references:

Massei [English Translation] p.122:
“To a question about the last time the victim would have been able to scream or emit a loud shout, the consultant replied as follows: “before being hit by the cutting injury blow”, the most important one, which also cut off the airways.”

Massei [English Translation]p.127:
“At the request of the accused’s *masculine, therefore Raffaele’s+ defence team, he *the consultant] explained that the breaking of the hyoid bone would not allow [the victim] to scream”.

Massei [English Translation]p.139:
“....on the breaking of the hyoid bone: “my larynx opens, I have a closure of the laryngeal inlet, a closure of the respiratory paths, I have [138] dysphonia, I can no longer speak, my vocal cords are no longer extended, I cannot scream, I can’t breathe any more or at best with difficulty since I can only breathe through the laryngeal dead space and I slowly die of asphyxiation” (page 117 of the transcripts).”

Massei [English Translation]p.140:
“At this point we have the injury to the hyoid bone; the victim can no longer speak, she cannot scream any longer, ...”

Massei [English Translation]p.145:
“...a hand placed on my mouth could prevent me from screaming, and likewise a wound like the one on the neck…” (page 38).”

Massei [English Translation]p.163:
“.... one sees no reason why – after inflicting the wounds on the neck which, due to the vital part of the body struck, the breaking of the hyoid bone and the blood flowing out, must have appeared particularly serious, preventing the victim from being able to scream (with reference to the most serious wound, see what the various Consultants have observed in this regard, particularly Professor Bacci) [164] – it would also have been necessary to seize and strangle the victim’s neck.”

Posted by Cardiol MD on 04/04/11 at 06:26 PM | #

James try this:

As anyone familiar with my TMJK Posts and Comments knows, it is a given with me that A,S, and G are as guilty as hell, where I think they should rot; they are also bare-faced liars brazenly trying to escape the consequences of their evil.

Not everything they say is false; they rely on distortions of the truth.

Guede apparently states he was present in the apartment when Meredith was murdered and he doesn’t deny that he left his poop behind.

Guede is reported to have stated that he “...leaned over her [Meredith] as she attempted to speak and [HE had] written the letters “AF” on the wall because HE couldn’t understand her attempted words.”


Meredith’s injuries [therefore] prevented her from phonating AT THAT TIME.

Meredith could STILL inhale and exhale, but AT THAT TIME she could not even whisper, let alone scream, AND she could not cough, AND she could not sneeze.

She could kind-of sigh, but without any sigh-phonation.


To me it adds credence to his above reported statement.

The most-probable killing-sequence is:

1. Meredith screams!
2. The killers panic.
3. In their panic they slit open Meredith’s trachea.
4. The slitting-open of the trachea and arterial blood spray were probably almost synchronous, exacerbating the panic.
5. No scream or coughing could have occurred AFTER that-opening of the trachea.

So, when Guede is reported to have stated that he “...leaned over her [Meredith] as she attempted to speak and [he had] written the letters “AF” on the wall because he couldn’t understand her attempted words.” the point to me is that this lends credence to the claims that:


Posted by Cardiol MD on 04/05/11 at 05:56 PM | #

Hi Cardiol,

I was really responding to all4justice who I think had assumed that Guede had written “AF” in blood on the wall. I said that surely there is no evidence (physical evidence such as marks) that he did this or tried to do so.

I fully agree with you about the consequences of the broken hyoid bone when the trachea was cut.

I am sure that the nightmare image of her trying to speak stayed with him for a long time, and probably still does.

But whether or not the air being exhaled and inhaled sounded like AF I am sure that the fact that AF sounds like RAF is why he included it in his statement. He had already dropped a heavy handed hint as to AK’s possible involvement and now he was doing the same with RS.  He just didn’t want to come across as too much of a snitch to start with and of course he had what he thought was a plausible defence and didn’t need that being undermined by either AK or RS. Whilst AK or RS doing so might seem highly unlikely I believe he didn’t trust them. He may even have been of the opinion that one or the other could be so deranged as to be quite unpredictable.

I am sure that he said fairly early on words to the effect that he wasn’t going to be the only person to go down for this but I can’t source that.

Posted by James Raper on 04/05/11 at 07:22 PM | #

Hi cardiol and James, and everyone. 

If I might clarify what I was thinking and meant, because no one has responded to my question and the responses have gone off in a different tangent to what I intended, no insult intended to anyone responding.  No one is obliged to respond to my questions, of course.  I do want to clarify what I meant and thought/think.

I do not believe that RG wrote anything on the wall.  That is why I postulated (and thought I was clear in the post, but perhaps not) that I think Meredith wrote on the wall after being left to die.  It would have been her only way of communicating at that stage, I expect.  We don’t know exactly when her phones were taken that night, but I agree with others that they were taken while she was still alive and the scumbags (AK, RS, RG) ran away leaving her bleeding and mortally wounded.  To have banged on the wall or floor to alert someone to come to her aid she would have known would prove nothing, as she knew everyone was away, and the killers had left, and no one lived close, and besides, it’s unlikely she had the strength to move her arms enough to pound a fist.  It does seem possible that if she were already near the wall, that she “might” have had the strength to try leaving a written notation to help us find justice for her after she was gone.  She had a very strong spirit.

I do think RG is lying about writing on the wall, and a LOT of other crucial things.  I think he was there when she was assaulted and left to die.  The best liars weave a tad of truth into their fabrications to attempt exoneration of themselves.  I believe that in making those statements (that we’re discussing here), he was drawing on his emotionally-charged and therefore embedded memories of seeing her in that horrible condition, mortally stabbed and bleeding profusely in order to attempt giving his statement detail and therefore some credibility.  Again, I believe he is guilty and, in particular relating to this discussion, lying about drawing on the walls (and other things).

I never believed she could speak after the most serious stab wound was made.  I never got that impression from anything I’ve read in the news, in TJMK, or in either of the sentencing reports (translated into English).  My husband had one side of his hyoid bone broken a few months ago in an unprovoked assault by a maniac in our apt. building and I was there in the ER when the specialists used an optical device through his nose and down his throat to diagnose the damage.  The stable fracture of one half of the hyoid bone left him barely speak and with serious trouble swallowing due to his vocal cords on one side being so swollen that they almost cut off his repiration.  He was given steriods for the swelling and monitored in hospital in critical care for 4 days with nothing by mouth for 3 days.  And that was only a tiny shade of the damage done to Meredith.  There is no comparison in degree of damage and consequences to Meredith, except to illustrate (1) how dangerous to survival even that degree of injury is to that area of the body, and (2) to backup my assertion that I never considered that Meredith could have uttered anything following severing of her hyoid bone and the other serious damage to her neck caused by the large kitchen knife.

Can anyone tell me if it is a fact that there was writing on the wall, if it was in her blood (DNA tests, etc.), if it looked like “AF”, and whether it was visible to the human eye or revealed by tests, e.g. luminol?

Thanks to all.  :]
P.S.  Please excuse my typo in my 1st post in this section.  I mistakenly wrote “his death” instead of “her death”.

Posted by all4justice on 04/08/11 at 05:13 AM | #

Salut James,

I totally agree with what you said, i.e. “I am sure that the fact that AF sounds like RAF is why he included it in his statement. He had already dropped a heavy handed hint as to AK’s possible involvement and now he was doing the same with RS.”


Posted by all4justice on 04/08/11 at 10:01 AM | #
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