Tuesday, April 21, 2015

The Certainties And Open Questions In The Amanda Knox Trial Starting In Florence On 9 June

Posted by Our Main Posters

Dr Giuliano Giambartolomei prosecutes in both the Sollecito and Knox trials

1. A Bizarre Crime

What Knox will soon be on trial for is one of the most bizarre crimes conceivable.

If you followed all the links in the post directly below this (with more to come soon) you will see that the evidence is overwhelming that Knox maliciously and self-servingly invented the Interrogation Hoax of 5-6 November 2007 for very little likelihood of benefit and with massive damage done to good people and the proud image of Italy.

So what does Knox do? Learn anything? No. She serves three years for framing Patrick - and comes right out of prison to repeat more or less the self-same crime but this time on steroids. Passages in her book and claims in interviews were almost hysterically insistent, and the email she sent to Judge Nencini in December 2013 even more-so. In that email she actually ranted on about torture.

And dozens of others in the US picked up on the false claims and, as Steve Moore and John Douglas and Bruce Fischer did, heavily embellished them. What Knox was convicted for is still right there on a dozen YouTubes all “helpfully” uploaded by Bruce Fischer. 

Some few in Italy might have been undecided a month ago whether Sollecito was really there when Meredith was murdered. But nobody at all in Italy likes the dangerous and inflammatory campaign Knox has spearheaded.

This really could be Knox’s OJ Simpson moment. This time she could face as much as six years, and the US would seem to have zero grounds to resist extradition.

And as Knox was finally confirmed as sentenced for calunnia to the detriment of Lumumba by Cassation in 2013, left unaffacted by Cassation in 2015, Knox can no longer make any claim to have been induced to do so by the police and prosecution.

If she has a viable defense nobody, repeat nobody, right now seems able to imagine it. 

2. The Certainties

The trial will begin on 9 June in the Florence courthouse in front of Judge Anna Liguori.  The lead prosecutor will be Dr Giuliano Giambartolomei who is also the chief prosecutor in the Sollecito & Gumbel book trial which convenes next on 30 April.

While charges in the Sollecito & Gumbel trial are for diffamazione and vilipendio (slander of officials and of the system) the anticipated charges in the Knox case are for the more serious crime of calunnia (for accusing justice officials of crimes in court).

For a very good reason, diffamazione and vilipendio and especially calunnia are taken more seriously in Italy than equivalent contempts in some other systems.

This is because of a long-running (if declining) tendency for “connected” defendants to try to take the justice system down a peg in the hope of an unfair break in trials they or their unsavory buddies are in the midst of.

3. The Open Questions

The Knox book and email to Judge Nencini and TV claims cannot be a part of a calunnia case but certainly can be used as evidence of Knox’s disingenuousness and malice. To what extent this will happen is not clear yet, but signs are a lot of online evidence on these lines is being captured.

Nor is it clear yet who will represent Knox. Possibly Ghirga and Dalla Vedova, but they may not be the “best” team for her as they are credited in Knox’s book for its content and they handed over as a court document the inflammatory Knox email to Judge Nencini. (Remember, Sollecito is not being defended in his trial by Bongiorno or Maori.) 

Nor is it clear yet what line Knox’s defense may take. It is quite out of the question that she again simply repeats the claims that already cost her three years signed off on twice by Cassation. If Sollecito seems seriously stuck for a defense, Knox seems even more-so.

Nor is it clear yet if the defense team will make an immediate bid to Cassation for dismissal. The Fifth Chambers which overturned the murder conviction is already deeply entangled and under scrutiny, and judges there may already be wondering if they have committed career suicide to very little real benefit for anyone.

Also it is not clear yet how this will impact the pending trial of Curt Knox and Edda Mellas for diffamazione for repeating as gospel Knox’s false claims to a British reporter, and we dont know how this will impact Oggi’s trial for enthusiastically publishing some of Knox’s false claims.

It is not clear yet how the Knox PR (if it is still active) or the pro-Knox opportunists or the highly confused US media will handle this - but to repeat as gospel any of Knox’s claims could from now on be legally radioactive.

it is not clear yet how the Obama Administration will (if at all) react to this. Whether there will again be covert intervention, or whether they will finally concede that Italy did get it right and crimes should be paid for and not given a free pass. 

Finally, will Knox again be a no-show in Florence, as she was (against her lawyers best advice) at her own appeal? And if so, will she and her forces again falsely claim that she is being tried in absentia? That wouldnt win her points in Italy.

4. Further Background

Click here:   1. Could The Italian Authorities Be Starting A Wave Of Libel + Slander Investigations?

Click here:   2. Interrogation Hoax: Knox Hearing On Calunnia Charges, Then Trial To Resume June 16

Click here:   3. Calunnia Claims At The Core Of The Problem For Amanda Knox - And Her Parents

Click here:   4. Knox Calunnia Hearing: Amanda Knox Enters Court Via The Underground Entrance

Click here:   5. Another In Seeming Never-Ending Disasters For Hapless Knox Campaign

Click here:   6. A Perugian Media Report (Neutral As Usual) In Italian On Knox’s Calunnia Hearing

Click here:   7. Curt Knox And Edda Mellas Defamation Trial To Go Ahead On July 4

Click here:   8. Umbria’s Chief Prosecutor Will Proceed Against Knox And Sollecito And Also Aviello

Click here:   9. The Curt Knox And Edda Mellas Diffamazione Trial Will Resume In Perugia 30 March.

Click here:   10. False Allegations Against Italian Officialdom Sparking Increasingly Tough Legal Reaction

Click here:   11. An Overview From Italy #2: Current Perceptions In Italy, Sollecito Case, Mignini’s Full Vindication

Click here:   12. With Diffamazione Complaint Against False Claims In Oggi Knox’s Legal Prospects Continue To Slide

Click here:   13. Expected Calunnia And Diffamazione Trials Could Reverse Another Attempt To Take Justice Down A Peg

Click here:   14. Questions For Knox: Did You Undergo An Illegal Interrogation By Mignini Or Did You Try To Frame Him?

Click here:   15. Desperate Ghirga Urges Amanda Knox To Show At Florence Appeal, But She’s Created More Problems

Click here:   16. Pushback Against Mafia Playbook Gathers Speed With Denial Of False Accusation of “Satanic Theory

Click here:   17. Why It Will Be Republic Of Italy v Knox And Sollecito For The Myriad False Claims They Have Made

Click here:   18. False Claims By Amanda Knox & The Book Team May End Up Costing $10 Million


Timely update!

Posted by Cardiol MD on 04/21/15 at 09:32 PM | #

Phew, thanks for that - it pretty well sums it up. Over to you Florence.

How on earth are they going to square the circle and come out smelling as fresh as daisies? Whatever they do from here on Byzantine corruption will be at the forefront of most minds. They’ve got themselves in one hell of a legal mess with no honourable exit - and the rest of the world can see that quite clearly.

Pretty damn embarrassing you’d have thought but I suspect there’s some prime movers and shadowy figures behind all this that wouldn’t understand such a word.

Anyway, I still have some residual (rapidly waning) belief that this is such a total, outlandish farce that it can ONLY come right in the end. 😊

Posted by Odysseus on 04/21/15 at 09:34 PM | #


Knox did say after the March 27, 2015 ruling that she loves Italy and would like to return.  Wonder how quickly she will change her tune when this calunnia trial starts.

My guess is either: (1) fake shivering and fake crying, or (2) angry indignation at being ‘‘persecuted’’ or ‘‘hunted’‘.  Likely a bit of both;

As for PR, Gogerty-Marriott has not only shut down, but purged its website completely.  Check it out.  The only contact information available on employees is for other emails


About the whole thing being ‘‘bizarre’‘, Pete, in a way it makes perfect sense.  Knox’s entire ‘‘justification’’ for accusing Lumumba was police brutality, assault, torture, starvation, etc… She has let it go on for nearly 8 years now.  She can’t back down now.  If she does, these questions will get asked:

(1) Why drop it now?  After insisting for nearly a decade, why stop making these claims?

(2) If the accusations against the police are false (or even grossly exaggerated), what other lies has she told?

(3) If assault/torture wasn’t the reason she accused Lumumba, then what was?

(4) Was her book, Waiting to be Heard, a $3.8 million fraud?

(5) Has this whole PR effort been a total crock?

Seriously, Knox can’t call it off.  Even with Judge Massei (2009), Judge Hellmann (2011), and Cassation (2013) going against her, even with 2015 Cassation not touching the issue, she can’t quit.  Ever.

Similarly with Sollecito, he is in too deep now.  How would be ever explain costing Vanessa her job, or nearly bankrupting his Dad?  Or all the time he spent in the U.S. badmouthing his home?  He can’t quit either.  Ever.

Sadly, I don’t think Rudy Guede will ever tell the full truth either.  Although he has said he’s sorry (leaps and bounds ahead of AK/RS), he has never been honest about that night.  Judge Micheli saw through him as a liar.  Even if he ‘‘came clean’‘, his version would ‘‘sanitize’’ his own involvement.

Posted by Chimera on 04/22/15 at 07:37 AM | #

Hi Odysseus

As I think we’ve agreed the system of justice has several system-wide problems some of which with luck may be addressed in the current reform round.

But Italians dont see the system in general as corrupt, they generally like it and appreciate that it achieves very low rates of crime. But they do see small factions corrupting it now and then in isolated cases - and are not known for not speaking out!

A point often made by Yummi (whose valuable guidance is at the core of the above post) is that over 100 police and prosecutors have died in recent years making Italy safer and putting some very bad guys away.

The Hellmann court corruption could easily be seen at the time, it was complained about quite publicly and widely. But the decision was to let Cassation turn any perverse outcome around - and in 2013 Cassation vehemently did.

Now again, observers and participants of the Italian justice system are not taking the perverse decision of the Fifth Chambers lying down. The Fifth Chambers is between a rock and a hard place here. Already critical informed commentaries are leaking out, and the trials mentioned in the post will speak volumes on guilt.

In OJ Simpson’s case justice would have been best served if his obvious guilt was recognised by the trial court but he was hounded by public opinion and the family of Ron Goldman for years during which his paranoia bounced through the roof.

In the US many others who thought they were home free have seen things come full circle years after they walked. The Robert Durst case is the one now in the news and despite his $100 million it looks like he will be tangled up in court for years.

Posted by Peter Quennell on 04/22/15 at 10:10 AM | #

Hi Chimera

I agree, she was in part a captive of a ruthless PR effort and a self-appointed thuggish gang which she found waiting when she got out. She did not get to choose. Rules for riding tigers say its better that one does not dismount.

But bizarre in the sense that it was pretty well the exact same crime twice, for which hard time had already been served. Most perps dont immediately repeat the exact same crime. Its not really a common norm.

Plus Knox was perpetrating all of this this and edging others on down the same slippery slope while her main legal process was still going on. She was under expensive legal guidance right then in both Italy and the US. What happened to that?

Knox should always have known how hard it is for her claims to win out at the end of the day, as she had sat through days and days (without protest) of trial testimony early in the trial in 2009 about events at the questura that night.

Italy did not just react negatively in isolation to her sharp-elbowed stint on the stand in summer of 2009 as described in the on-the-spot posts below, Italy reacted negatively having already witnessed days of testimony from investigators showing the truth was 180 degrees the other way.



Posted by Peter Quennell on 04/22/15 at 10:37 AM | #

To normal minded people, Knox’s lies seem to be easily disproven and completely mad, however, she was so desperate to squeeze her way out of her mess that she came up with this poor-me excuse and has had to stick with it or appear like the filthy liar she is.  She lies easily thanks to the fact that she is narcissistic, arrogant and of the opinion that she is superior to those who question her.  She is a nasty piece of work and the longer those who surround her spend time with her, the more they will be forced to appreciate that fact.  She is her own worst enemy.

Posted by MHILL4 on 04/22/15 at 11:14 AM | #


True. I defer to your (and Yummi’s) greater knowledge of Italy and their system of justice, and your wise counsel to take the long view: the overweight lady is still in the wings having a prophylactic gargle, she’ll come on stage and sing when she’s good and ready -:)

Posted by Odysseus on 04/22/15 at 11:42 AM | #


Agreed - the pathetic “poor me” routine seems second nature to her when she’s in a fix - probably has its genesis in early childhood. Someone should have called her on it then.

Posted by Odysseus on 04/22/15 at 11:51 AM | #

My apologies if I missed this, but does she have to defend herself? How does it work? Could she just ignore the charges and lodge no defense?

I’m worried that there is some way she can just ignore the charges since she’s now in the US.

Posted by devorah on 04/22/15 at 04:56 PM | #

devorah: Me too.  After 03/27 I am sadly lacking in confidence that Knox will be held accountable. Hope I’m wrong.  Perhaps Yummi and/or Pete can set the stage with more clarity regarding the upcoming court dates: If Knox completely ignores the proceedings, what options will the Italian court have?  Outside of any rulings, is there any action enforceable given that she will not be leaving Seattle?

Posted by whatswisdom on 04/22/15 at 05:57 PM | #

Italy’s justice system and some of its police and prosecutors have been made into the most impugned in the world. This is damaging to Italy, to the organizations, to the officials, to their families, and to the cause of justice anywhere. 

Knox played a very large part. She was already punished and the record set straight - and then both of those were maliciously reversed, along with the hijacking of the Hellmann court. 

Assuming Ghirga and Dalla Vedova dont simply step aside, they will be there in court. As the post says, its right now an unknown whether Knox voluntarily attends the trial herself.

As this is a serious felony,  she may have no choice.

If she no-shows, a warrant could be issued for her arrest, possibly followed by a Red Notice if she goes on the lam. Same goes for a guilty verdict at the end.  An extradition request is in the cards.

Up to the end of 2011 Knox was always eager to try to make her own case. She asked for the December 2007 interview with Mignini, she seeemingly spoke to Judge Micheli in October 2008 (closed court), she certainly got on the stand for two days at her own volition mid 2009, and she intervened spontaneously twice during the Hellmann appeal.

But then at her own appeal in Florence she failed to show, though her lawyers flew to Seattle to try to get her there. She sent the ill-fated email to Judge Nencini instead. With the fact of the drug dealer she helped to imprison and those dozens she impugned she may be scared to meet any face to face.

My own bet is (1) Italy DOES pursue this till the record is again set straight; and (2) Knox is going to have to attend to win some points at court. Both the Massei and Hellmann jurors had some sympathy for her - thought she was very obviously mixed up. She could hope for that again.

Its hard to see any reason for Cassation to immediately throw this out. They should have no problem setting this record straight as Cassation itself confirmed Knox guilty on Calunnia #1.

And the civil courts in Italy, the UK and the US could also be used to set the record straight. That is a whole other track, and many foreign lawyers are strongly on Italy’s side.

Posted by Peter Quennell on 04/22/15 at 06:26 PM | #

Peter, given Knox has recently bleated on about being broke I wonder if she is able to pay her legal fees?  If not, her solicitors may be unwilling to continue to represent her.  I wonder how this would factor in, is she eligible for free legal help in the US?

Posted by MHILL4 on 04/23/15 at 08:29 AM | #

MHILL4—there is some legal aid/free representation in Italy for poor defendants.  It is what Rudy Guede used.  Can’t see the U.S. doing it, as Knox is not charged with a crime there.  Even if the Americans were, it would not sit well, given Knox publicly made $3.8 million from her blood money book.

One can see the headline now: white, attractive accused murderess, and multi-millionaire gets legal aid, while homeless shoplifter struggles to.

It is an interesting question about who would represent her (money not withstanding).  Knox kind of burned her lawyers, Ghirga and Vedova by crediting them as helping to write her book.  Not at all the publicity they need.  And after 8 years, they are probably thoroughly fed up with her and her lies and games.

Posted by Chimera on 04/23/15 at 09:59 AM | #

Hi MHILL4 and Chimera

Interesting catch by MHILL4. The money-grubbing was incessant and pervasive by the families and the hangers-on and Ergon for one got some hard facts and posted them. They did not look pretty.

Opinions on how much Knox actually got for her book vary; Stilicho who is a CPA I respect has argued that the actual money changing hands would be strongly related to sales revenue and that the claimed “up to $4 million” was a sales device and nothing more.  He and others estimate that book sales were never more than in the low thousands. 

Ghirga and Dalla Vedova and the staffs and experts were always paid to our knowledge.  At one point Francesco Sollecito actually came out very angrily that he and his family were having to pay all costs from their own resources whereas the Knox operation appeared to him to be raisng money by the ton via its inflammatory PR operation.

An outcome of Calunnia #1 2009-2011-2013 on which ALL courts ruled Knox was guilty was that she was to pay Patrick the equivalent of around $100,000. She defiantly has paid him nothing yet and uses various versions of the Interrogation Hoax and her ECHR appeal as her excuse for that.

Remember it is for trying to hide money and making money he should have been handing over to the Goldman family that led OJ Simpson to prison for 9 to 30 years for armed robbery.

Maybe better for Knox not to go that particular route… 

Posted by Peter Quennell on 04/23/15 at 05:06 PM | #

Peter and MHILL4,

It was reported in the Summer of 2013 that Knox’s book had sold about 36,000 copies, (as opposed to the 750,000 that HarperCollins expected).  That is <5% of sales projections met. 

A fair assumption to make is that many/most of the sales were to people involved in the case, perhaps to use as evidence.  She has no real following.

Another fair assumption is that the immediate release was where all the sales happened, and that they nosedived afterwards.  I would speculate that another 2,000 (maximum) have since been sold.  That is still only about 38,000, and still about 5% of the expected selling.

Stilicho’s reasoning makes sense.  If you (for the sake of argument), assume a linear relation ship between sales and royalties, selling 5% of the books would get 5% of the $3.8 million, or about $190,000 total.  Even if there was an upfront advance, Knox would have gotten ‘‘maybe’’ $500,000 total.

It is funny, Knox claims that the $3.8 million is gone because of taxes, legal fees, and paying back her parents. 

It seems too embarrassing to admit she is still broke since the book tanked.

Posted by Chimera on 04/24/15 at 03:04 AM | #
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