Sunday, June 06, 2010

Knox, Anthony, and Van Der Sloot: Why Some Murder Suspects Revel In Their Sudden Prominence

Posted by Peter Quennell

Click here for Barbie Nadeau’s report on bizarre murder suspect mindsets in Newsweek.

Quite typical of charming psychopaths.

Today Barbie Nadeau starts with the Dutch murder suspect Joran Van der Sloot, possible killer of 21-year-old Stephany Flores Ramirez, whose capture in Chile and extradition to Peru (video above) has been on every US newscast.

He has previously been shown on TV in an interview secretly filmed (video below) in which he gleefully pretty well admits that he killed American student Natalee Holloway in Aruba, a Caribbean island that is an integral part of the kingdom of the Netherlands.

Now, as such smug suspects often do, he seems to have killed again.

In this case, as in the case of Casey Anthony, who is charged with killing her baby daughter Caylee, there has been no murder suspect’s PR campaign, no adolescent sliming of the prosecutors, and no adolescent mis-stating of the evidence. The true victim is the one getting all the sympathy.

The far more typical stance of the US media in such cases.

Certainly no one is more famous as an irreverent celebrity suspect than Seattle native Amanda Knox, who is serving a 26-year sentence for the sexual assault and murder of her British roommate, Meredith Kercher, in Perugia, Italy.

In the early days of the Kercher murder investigation, Knox and her former boyfriend, Raffaele Sollecito, acted absurdly. Knox, with no apparent grasp of the seriousness of a murder investigation, performed cartwheels for the cops in the police station waiting room.

The two suspects admitted to being high before talking to police, as Sollecito said, “to take the edge off.” They told investigators multiple stories and lies, including Knox’s naming her Congolese nightclub boss as the real assassin.

For added flavor, she even described Kercher’s screams to investigators. During her 11-month trial, she behaved like a beauty queen on the runway, making what jurors later called a mockery of the court by her blatant disrespect of the Italian legal system.

In the final days of her trial, when things were looking grim, she started to act demure. By then it was too late.

Dupes like Oprah and Geraldo Rivera and certain others should wake up to the true danger of charming psychopaths. They do tend to kill again. And also wake up to the one true victim in Perugia, whose name was Meredith Kercher.

By the way, in a bizarre parallel, it now seems that Joran Van Der Sloot is setting out to further entangle his mother.

Posted by Peter Quennell on 06/06/10 at 06:00 AM in Various hypothesesThe psychologyThe legal followups


The thing that Amanda Knox, Joran van der Sloot, Casey Anthony and also Dutch killer Sander V., who raped and killed a 12 year old neighbor girl in March, have in common is their heavy use of pot.

Using drugs makes it harder to control yourself, so if there is ugly demons within a person, they are more likely to be unleashed when under the influence. Drug users lose their touch with reality and that effect can last for weeks after the use of the substances. In some cases it can permanently alter your mind, even after minimal or first time use.

Posted by saskia on 06/07/10 at 12:49 PM | #

Hi Saskia. It is easy to find examples that prove your point. Here is one.

Our subjective impression is that skunk cannabis seems to be being pointed to in the ongoing studies more than cocaine and crystal meth as a cause of psychotic episodes, though all three apparently can cause them. Skunk cannabis is simply genetically enhanced cannabis, and there is a lot of it around. RS and AK claimed it was cannabis they were on on the night. Prosecutor Mignini believed it was cocaine.

All signs are that the judges who saw the confidential psychological tests done in prison did not like what they saw, one component of why house arrest was refused (the other was the possibility of fleeing). Presumably the two were not on drugs during those tests. Knox’s apparent extended period of enjoyment after Meredith’s death, which extended even into her testimony in her trial, might be a very bad sign.

Posted by Peter Quennell on 06/07/10 at 01:42 PM | #

Please check the first video. It seems not to be avialable any longer.

Posted by Dr. Weissnix on 06/07/10 at 03:17 PM | #

Hi Dr. Weissnix. Please keep clicking on the arrow or black center? This video (uploaded by Fox News) is still starting fast here in New York. Some YouTubes just seem to start slowly when there is a lot of demand.


Added: is the top video showing up in all areas now?


By the way, we capture and keep files of these YouTubes and sometimes upload them to our own account, as in the cases of Jeanine Piro’s and Lis Wiehl’s remarks. But generally the networks keep them up on YouTube and don’t seem to succumb to any pressures.

The only YouTubes we posted that were removed before we grabbed the files were those of the anti-Italy screaming fest on the Jane Velez Mitchell crime show on CNN.  They were removed when the guilty verdict came through (what a surprise).

Posted by Peter Quennell on 06/07/10 at 04:26 PM | #

Peruvian police video of Van Der Sloot and his presumed victim, 21-year-old Stephany Flores Ramirez, whose father is very prominent in Peru. There’s no soundtrack.

He is apparently now under suicide watch. Peruvian prisons sound a lot less comfortable than Italian. Stephany’s money (believed around $6,000) was missing, and also expensive jewelery. Maybe they helped pay for Van Der Sloot’s attempted escape, via Chile.

Posted by Peter Quennell on 06/07/10 at 04:33 PM | #

Many Dutch posters on forums and YouTubes are keen to point out that in the Netherlands the belief that Van Der Sloot killed Natalie Holloway is almost universal. They really have no time for him.

Nice country, Netherlands. People very kind and very smart. You have to admire that they distance themselves from a probable Dutch killer of American and Peruvian women.

Posted by Peter Quennell on 06/07/10 at 04:52 PM | #

This is beyond weird. Let’s hope no-one in Capanne gets similar ideas.

Posted by Peter Quennell on 06/07/10 at 08:45 PM | #

Peter, I think there may be a “location filter” on that first video, I can’t access it in the UK.

As for that last link you posted….unbelievable.

It is beyond belief that someone would try to obtain money like that; it is terrible that another young woman has lost her life…

I hope that the truth is uncovered for the families of both victims.

Posted by Nolongeramember on 06/08/10 at 12:07 AM | #

Here’s a new CNN report about Van Der Sloot that uses the word “charming” in the very first sentence. The whole report is an eye-opener.

When we first posted on charming psychopaths, a reader remarked that Sollecito didn’t seem to them very charming.

But he has charmed some people in Italy and he still has a small following there. The existence of a fervent bunch of groupies is one of the indicators.

Perhaps they should have their own bumper sticker.

Posted by Peter Quennell on 06/08/10 at 12:22 AM | #

Hi Innai. Possible location filter blocking the top YouTube… okay, thanks. The media sometimes do that so they can insert a commercial or maybe stop rebroadcast around the world.

We will upload the file or perhaps better find another. It was a good concise report, but it is now several days old and you would catch newer on ITN or BBC - or on CNN Global if you get it; do you, out of interest?


Added: is the top video showing up in all areas now?

Posted by Peter Quennell on 06/08/10 at 01:30 AM | #

Pete wrote: “Here’s a new CNN report about Van Der Sloot that uses the word “charming” in the very first sentence. The whole report is an eye-opener.”

It was interesting how JvdS answered in an interview: “I would never murder a girl.”

Isn’t that similar to how Amanda phrased her denials? I think someone (Hopeful?) pointed this out recently in another comment. How Amanda said things like “Meredith was my friend, I wouldn’t kill her,” but never really categorically denied it, never really simply stated that she didn’t kill her.

I noticed the similar usage of the word “would.” It’s as if Joran (or Amanda) is saying, “I *would* never murder a girl, unless I got *really* angry and she *made* me do it!” It’s another way of blaming the victim.

My deepest sympathies to the Flores family, and of course the Holloway/Twittys.

Posted by Earthling on 06/08/10 at 06:27 AM | #

I couldn’t access the top video yesterday, but I have been able to see it this morning (in Ankara, Turkey).

Posted by Ann-Marie on 06/08/10 at 07:06 AM | #

Regarding the second video, it is absolutely disgusting to see how satisfied Joran van der Sloot is with the outcome of his lies and deceit. I’ve got the impression he believes to be really a great guy.

In an article from Perú I’ve read that he considers himself to be good-looking, but was disappointed that girls in Perú didn’t want to accompany him home.

That actually shows how narrow minded he is. Perú and Aruba are two different pairs of shoes: The women are a bit more conservative in Perú than they are in Aruba, where he was partying 24/7.

He, same as Amanda Knox, has an exaggerated opinion of himself. Just a coincidence? I don’t think so.

Posted by Nell on 06/08/10 at 07:45 AM | #

I just read that Joran van der Sloot has confessed to have murdered Stephany Flores:

He made a statement acknowledging that he killed Stephany Flores who had used his laptop while he was out taking some breakfast. She found out about his involvement in the Natalee Holloway disappearance and he got angry and killed her.

If his words are truthful, that is another story. According to police, Stephany Flores wasn’t raped. She died from a brain haemorrhage. She was apparently beaten with a tennis racket. Her neck was broken.

Posted by Nell on 06/08/10 at 08:24 AM | #

(Both videos working now for me too, thank you, Peter)

In the second video the thing that stood out for me was that van der Sloot spoke of just having to act normally - then he said he would be, essentially, using the media hype to his advantage (that’s how I take “I can abuse that as well” said with a smile (@2.25))....he also thinks he is “smart”.  Hopefully the authorities find enough hard evidence to try him and justice can be served.

Regarding Sollecito and whether or not he is charming, I don’t think he is playing to “us”, the international internet community - I don’t know if he still does, but he wrote a weekly article for his hometown paper I believe.  He lamented not being able to get certain foods etc - he seemed to be wooing the home crowd, trying to build support locally.  A reasonably focussed charm offensive, generating a the small following Peter described above.  Maybe that was a smart move considering the negative effects of a wider PR campaign…

Posted by Nolongeramember on 06/08/10 at 10:08 AM | #

To me, Raffaele Sollecito seems way smarter than Amanda Knox, but that might be, because he simply chose to shut up. While she was taking the heat for her accusations against the police, he just had to lean back and let her be the focus of attention. Beside her it is probably easy to appear “normal” (using that word loosely here, of course).

Edda Mellas said not so long ago that the family “shielded” Amanda as good as possible from the “outside world” so that she wouldn’t know what was said and written about her. I then wondered if it was to hide how the super-duper PR campaign went slowly but steady down the drain.

I don’t think that a wider PR campaign necessarily would have a negative effect. In this particular case I believe it was how it was conducted. It was insulting. We were asked to believe the earth is flat and that Amanda Knox was the victim, instead of Meredith Kercher. These people - unknowingly - exposed themselves as what they are, people with low morals, selfish and ignorant.

Posted by Nell on 06/08/10 at 02:41 PM | #

Hi Nell. It seems totally lost on the Amanda Knox groupies (so what’s new?!) just how much harm Raffaele Sollecito has already done to Amanda Knox’s defense.

The Knox-Mellases and the groupies seem to think that he fully confirmed that he and Knox were together all night and that RS’s computer records show this and that thus her alibi is water-tight.

Far from it.

The Knox-Mellases and groupies should read the Machine’s amazing posts ten months ago here and here and here.

She is already cooked.

And if Sollecito separates himself out in the appeal, now being rumored as likely, she will be even more cooked.

It is not only Amanda Knox herself who seems slow-witted or flat-footed by comparison. It is everyone around her.

Posted by Peter Quennell on 06/08/10 at 03:17 PM | #

The Lima press conference will apparently be at 10 this morning east coast time and US cable news may carry some or all of it live.

There should be something interesting to post on after this. Van Der Sloot is looking worse and worse. So, it seems, is a nervous FBI.

Posted by Peter Quennell on 06/10/10 at 04:34 PM | #
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Where next:

Click here to return to The Top Of The Front Page

Or to next entry The Associated Press Confirms That Joran Van Der Sloot Has Confessed To Murder In Lima, Peru

Or to previous entry The Sad Case Of Sonia Marra #9: Extreme Caution Over Non-Repetitive Testing In Sonia’s Case Too